Have You Hugged a Hummer Today?

[Taigo]

Did you!?

If not here´s a pretty interesting article (http://www.reason.org/commentaries/dalmia_20060719.shtml) that might make your day. :)

[Stang Seller]

That doesn't mean anything really, there are a thousand and one ways to look at something to skewer it to your agenda. Just because a Hummer has a lower 'dust to dust' cost doesn't mean people should be going out to purchase one!

[Marros]

The main reason I don't like Hummers is because they are too big and cause problems in parking lots. I don't have any problem with the military using them as all-terrain transports, but I see no reason for a family with 1 or 2 kids to buy one unless they are towing a giant boat around everywhere.

May be cheaper to build and maintain than a Prius, but it sure as hell isn't practical.

[Taigo]

That´s not the point, the point is that its more environmental friendly to buy anything but a prius or a hybrid car.

Offcourse, we would spend less energy and resources if everybody just maintained their cars properly instead rushing out to the dealers to buy the latest model of a "ecological car" wich in fact, is less ecological than a humvee.

[superbug73]

That really doesn't surprise me. Newer technologies in most cases will require a lot more cost to develop/produce than a basic evolution of an existing product. It may be true that the dust to dust fuel cost of the Prius is more than a Hummer right now, but as hybrid and other fuel saving technologies emerge and further permeate the roadways, I would imagine that costs for development etc will decline.

But I am pretty skeptical about a lot of the green tech out there. In principal I think they're great, but I don't think that manufacturers are looking at the bigger picture a lot of the time. Here's another interesting article about another 'green' technology that is actually a detriment to the environment.

Click Here (http://www.autoblog.com/2008/02/21/science-magazine-declares-ethanol-worse-for-the-earth-than-fossi/)

[DevilMan]

Or you could buy a enviro-friendly hummer. At SEMA this past year I saw one that the company claimed would do something like 80 mpg if memory serves. Im almost positive it was a diesel ran on bio-diesel. My memory sucks, and that week was nothing but a huge party, so that doesnt help the ole memory. :)

[Taigo]

Not only for the costs, but hybrids are a potential disaster speaking in long terms.
You might say that the emissions are really low for a hybrid car, and that might be true, but nobody ever thinks about what happen with the batteries
They are building a hell lot of hybrids, and all that nickel will have to go somewhere someday..

And yeah, ethanol from corn is just stupid.

[Ayce]

There's only one way to end the argument.












WALK! Barefoot and naked to manual labour jobs. Writing with sticks in the sand.

No matter what we do, someone, somewhere will say it's environmentally unsound. Even if we manage to get out from under the thumb of the dinosaur oil barons (PTP) with full electric powered vehicles, be they solar or hydrogen powered, some one will complain the manufacturing / disposal process pollutes. Can't win.


And we don't have matter/antimatter engines yet. ;)

[DevilMan]

Im in the oilfield, have been all my life, as well as my Dad and mom, and step dad... so I say DOWN with going green!!! Lets stick with what has worked for the past 100 years, and keep food on my table :)

[Hemiorange]

Im in the oilfield, have been all my life, as well as my Dad and mom, and step dad... so I say DOWN with going green!!! Lets stick with what has worked for the past 100 years, and keep food on my table :)

Its worked for 100 years?... Earth is 4.5 billion years old and humans have been in existence for 200k years. Do you realize how insignificant 100 years is on that scope?, and that it proves nothing.

[superbug73]

Not only for the costs, but hybrids are a potential disaster speaking in long terms.
You might say that the emissions are really low for a hybrid car, and that might be true, but nobody ever thinks about what happen with the batteries
They are building a hell lot of hybrids, and all that nickel will have to go somewhere someday..

And yeah, ethanol from corn is just stupid.

Its like the Nuclear Reactor argument, yeah it's eliminating the need for coal-fired power plants, but somewhere down the road, all that nuclear waste is gonna have to be put somewhere. And you know damn well that some day there is gonna be a spill or some sort of accident on a large-scale with the waste, and things won't be pretty.

[Taigo]

There's only one way to end the argument.












WALK! Barefoot and naked to manual labour jobs. Writing with sticks in the sand.

No matter what we do, someone, somewhere will say it's environmentally unsound. Even if we manage to get out from under the thumb of the dinosaur oil barons (PTP) with full electric powered vehicles, be they solar or hydrogen powered, some one will complain the manufacturing / disposal process pollutes. Can't win.


And we don't have matter/antimatter engines yet. ;)


Your post kinda reminds a a blog that was pretty interesting.
I still think that your post is inaccurate, we cant stop the progress just because we think that´s the solution, but we must realize when we are doing something lamme, pointless and stupid (not in the same order)

Propane powered cars are not bad, the petrol ones aren´t bad as the hybrids, there´s air powered cars and even water engines.


"7) Global climate change is clearly a big deal. It doesn't matter whether it's anthropogenic or a consequence of natural variation in insolation — it's going to affect us either way, and the cause only affects us insofar as it might determine some of the things we've got to do to survive it. Similarly, it's fairly clear that we are not, contrary to orthodox Green ideology, going to deal with this by wailing, putting on hair shirts, and going back to being pre-industrial peasant subsistence farmers. Nor are we going to deal with it by reducing our carbon budget. (You want to reduce our species' carbon budget? Get a rifle and shoot someone. You don't get a lower carbon budget than a corpse. NB: please don't suggest this to some of our more excitable politicians who might be worrying about meeting their carbon trading limits in the near future. That would be Bad.) No; dealing with global climate change is going to take big business and big engineering projects. Lots of nuclear reactors, solar power farms, and plants pumping CO2 into the salt domes of evacuated oil and gas fields. All of which means it's going to cost big money, but in turn, it's going to make big profits for the companies that wise up first and realize that mitigating climate change can be a shiny new business proposition. Please, let's stop thinking negative-sum about climate change and start thinking positive-sum? Capitalism will clean up its own **** — once it acquires a new set of taste buds and realizes it's delicious."


What I want for Christmas (http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2007/12/what_i_want_for_christmas.html)

[greaserboy]

Lithium Ion Hybrids and Li-Ion full electric cars are the way of the future.

I'm working on retrofitting my Insight with Li-Ion batteries, and maybe going full electric eventually.

[Ayce]

I hope you all see my post how it is meant, with tongue firmly planted in cheek. ;) I know we will never go back to "stone knives and bear skins" but at the same time we can't permit greed to be the driving force behind our way of life much longer. Something will have to give, and I hope it isn't Mother Earth.
As far as full electric vehicles go, that's a whole 'nother kettle of fish.
Some don't like them because they are "slow and don't go far enough" Well, isn't that what racing is for? I'm not talking about those funky distance races they hold in OZ, I'm talking about circuit or road races. If it wasn't for auto racing pioneers testing and refining the limits of their vehicles, mostly on their own $, who knows what we would be driving. As it stands, we would need corporate sponsorship pushing the idea before anything could happen. IMO, nothing progresses auto development better than brave souls pushing their cars and selves to the limits.

If horse owners had the attitude that big oil and auto companies have today, we'd still be using them instead of cars. "Get a horse!" was the saying back in the early days of auto development. Once people started racing them, the technology took off. That's one thing about us humans, we'll race anything.:D

[Mopar4life]

im just gonna stick with my good ol' pollutin 340. I probably wont be here long enough to see the environment die so ill rev my V8 proudly into the atmosphere.

[Ayce]

http://en.autos.sympatico.msn.ca/GreenCentre/article.aspx?cp-documentid=6469455

An article describing the HFC Equinox.

[Marros]

Looks like a decent SUV, but I am not very fond of GM's truck/suv lineup these days. I have to say that I would go with the Honda fuel cell cars right now, or the BMW Hydrogen-7. A more practical clean car right now is the Honda Civic GX, which you can fill up at home through your city natural gas line.

[Javelin]

That article is nearly 2 years old, the Prius is selling well now. Also they based the dust2dust for the Hummer on 300K miles. Though I dont know, I doubt that unless they were using the H1 vehicle. The others are GM based I believe (H2 & H3). BTW, AM General used to be owned by AMC!

Also the Prius was based on 100k, I would guess that will be higher.

I'm not defending anyone here, just pointing out that researchers can sometimes massage the data to get the results they want.

And with all this research going on, where is my full size pickup that gets 50mpg and pulls 5k lbs! :) In my dreams I guess :(